Comments for Obama's Birth Certificate - Still Missing at http://www.rightsidenews.com , comment 1 to 38 out of 20 comments http://www.rightsidenews.com Sat, 21 Nov 2009 02:43:55 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-4335 "No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States". Why no media outlet has ever brought in a constitutional expert to discuss the " natural born " clause to settle this issue for the Ameerican people is because they won't and most likely can't. Why, because the definition of " natural born " can easily be found in the clause itself. In short, your " parents " have to be citizens of the United States for their offspring to be considered " natural born ". If you read this closely " No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President ". What this did was those within the borders of the United States " at the time of the Adoption of " would become " legal " citizens of the United States. Their offspring would be " natural born ". The Constitution created legal citizens of the United States. People get confused a little bit because of the order in which " No person except a natural born Citizen" and " or a Citizen of the United States " appear. Their were no constitutional " natural born citizens " prior to the constitution. In simple terms the forefathers had to start somewhere and that somewhere is the Constitution of the United States. So you can see that " at the time of the Adoption of " created legal "citizens" of the United States that would produce " natural born ctizens ". The fact that the Father of President was not an American citizen disqualifies Barack Obama from the Presidency or should have. - American Birther Mon, 02 Nov 2009 17:38:17 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1928 You'd think the world was about to descend into chaos because Hawaii automated their vital records system and stopped photocopying paper from the books. Besides the Flat Earth Society (and maybe the faked moon landing), this is got to be the fringe theory with less gas in the tank that any other I know of. I have caught these guys in more lies than I can count. How can people be so gullible as to be led around by the nose by the likes of Berg, and Orly, and Kidd, and Ed Hale, and Swirsky? - Dr. Conspiracy Sun, 29 Mar 2009 19:59:01 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1711 Straight to the point---if Obama would just release the originals showing his place of birth this could all be settled--so simple, why doesn't he just do it. Does he have something to hide--starting to look that way to this one. - Ron Russell Tue, 10 Mar 2009 06:09:13 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1644 I have serious doubts about any resolution of this issue in the American judicial system---doubt if any judge will have the stomach for the challenges the issure presents. If, indeed, there is something out there I believe it will have to come from Kenya. At the present time and under the existing administration in Kenya this will not occur. That said, Kenya is in a very unstable part of the world, with the detoriating situation in Robert Mugabe's kingdom to the west and the pressure of radical Islamic forces to the north and in country. It is not a far-fetched idea that revolution and regime change could occur and a new order established that would not be favorable to Obama. We'll just have to wait and see. - Ron Russell Mon, 02 Mar 2009 03:17:23 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1119 For those " seriously " interested in the litigation of the Barack Obama, Jr birth certificate " JOKE ", here are some links to the actual court papers. What you should "note" is that at no time has Barack Obama, Jr nor anyone related to the issue responded to the allegations by claiming or providing evidence that Barack Obama, Jr. qualifies under the " natural born " clause. http://www.fec.gov/law/litigation/berg_ac_fec_opp_emerg_mot.pdf http://www.fec.gov/law/litigation/berg_ac_obama_resp_emerg_mot.pdf http://www.fec.gov/law/litigation/berg_mem_order_dismiss.pdf What you should also take " note " of why these cases are being dismissed. - RichieRich Wed, 07 Jan 2009 04:11:58 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1108 Tom your just another misguided American courtesy of it's public school system. Ronald Reagen; [quote]If an unfriendly foreign power had attempted to impose on America the mediocre educational performance that exists today, we might well have viewed it as an act of war.[/quote] No sense arguing with you nor your kind. - RichieRich Tue, 06 Jan 2009 13:41:58 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1099 I just noticed the part of this article that suggests that Obama's grandmother wasn't really facing serious health problems. That's the same grandmother who died before the election. Compassionate conservatism wins again. - Tom Moore Mon, 05 Jan 2009 10:47:14 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1094 Wow, you're hostile. Maybe if you calmed down you wouldn't have typed the most ironic phrase on this page: "your ... retarded." [b]Natural-born Citizen[/b] The Fourteenth Amendment references two kinds of citizens: those by birth and those who are naturalized. If you are a citizen at birth, you are natural born. The amendment adds a new means of being a citizen at birth: being born in the U.S., subject to its jurisdiction. Schwarzenegger clearly does not fall into this category. Obama does. Do you really think that Obama was naturalized at some point? When? Seriously, there has never been a point in his life in which he was not a citizen. Courts often interpret laws in light of the purposes behind them. Blocking Obama's presidency serves none of the purposes behind the natural born citizenship clause (which you brought up when you referenced Jay's letter). The Supreme Court will never invalidate Obama's Presidency and he will become the 44th President of the United States. The courts don't want to go near this and only fringe elements of the Republican Party care about it. Your own party leadership wants nothing to do with this issue and cares more about recovering from the devastating electoral defeats that it experienced during the past two elections. [b]Establishment Clause[/b] The Bill of Rights is part of the Constitution. The Declaration of Independence is not. It was signed over a decade before the Constitution was even adopted. We even had a separate government between the two documents. Do you think that the Articles of Confederation are binding as well? You are really revealing your ignorance if you think the Declaration is a legal document on par with the bill of rights, which was properly ratified. The Constitution, which actually governs our nation, does not reference God. It only limits governmental involvement with religion. Why would I want to leave the U.S., when I already live in a nation governed by secular laws? The Constitution even prohibits religious tests for those who hold public office. If you want a theocracy, maybe you should look elsewhere. As for the Establishment Clause only applying to legislative activity, that clause was incorporated against other parts of the government by the Fourteenth Amendment, as is recognized by a strong line of Supreme Court decisions. It also prohibits much more than just a national religion. Note that it doesn't say "no law establishing a religion," but says "no law respecting an establishment of religion." The best interpretation of this clause requires government neutrality towards religion. We live in a pluralistic society with people from a variety of religious backgrounds. Look at European history if you want an example of what happens when the government makes it its business to determine which religious stance is correct. Finally, I did go to a public school. Luckily, that school that taught me about correct apostrophe usage. - Tom Moore Sun, 04 Jan 2009 22:23:39 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1088 Source: Lawrence B. Solum, University of Illinois College of Law. What was the original public meaning of the enigmatic phrase that establishes the eligibility for the office of President of the United States? There is general agreement on the core of settled meaning. Anyone born on American soil whose "parents" are citizens of the United States of American is a "natural born citizen. Source: Book Law of Nations “The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of "parents" who are citizens. Source: Harvard Law Professor Laurence H. Tribe, California Federal Court decision. Based on the original meaning of the Constitution, the Framers' intentions, and subsequent legal and historical precedent, Senator McCain's birth to "parents" who were U.S. citizens, serving on a U.S. military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936, makes him a 'natural born citizen' within the meaning of the Constitution,". My reference to John Jay was in support of what prompted the clause. Like many during the Constitutional convention they were concerned about the possibility of foreign influence if Presidents were not " natural born ". There are few modern day liberal's that attempt to disguise the meaning. Most of them are of the opinion that the clause should be done away with but they do know what it means. You know what it means. You also know that Barack Obama, Jr. should be disqualified. We all know what will happen if he is. I don't think the Supreme Court wants to touch this with a 3,000 mile long pole. The powers at be are going to have to find another way to get out of this situation so Barack Obama, Jr can bow out with as little legal ramifications as possible. I have theory of what is going to happen and the ground work for that started a few weeks ago. It's been in the media and I'll leave it at that. I will be very surprised if we see a Barack Obama, Jr inauguration. Very surprised. - RichieRich Sun, 04 Jan 2009 13:44:05 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1081 [quote]There are two kinds of citizens: those who are natural-born and those who are naturalized. The fourteenth amendment made Obama a citizen at the time of his birth because he was born in the United States. As such, when you combine the manner in which English common law recognized natural born citizens and the fourteenth amendment, Obama is natural born and did not have to be naturalized. [/quote] The 14th Amendmant reads: [quote]All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.[/quote] If this pertained to the Presidency and Vice Presidency then if you were naturalized in the United States you could become President. Then I ask " why can't Arnold Schwarzenegger " become President?. This clause makes no reference to " natural born " nor distinguishes any differnece between born or naturalized. Further makes nor has any merit at all to Section I, Article II. You obviously haven't a clue to what you are talking about. John McCain was born on a American military installation in the Panama Canal Zone and was the offspring of "2 American citizen's". Now if you want to insinuate that because John McCain, Sr. was called to duty to serve his country in the Panama Canal Zone which subsequently led to John Mccain, Jr's birth their as a comparable argument to Barack Obama, Jr. your either retarded or lack any reasonable ability to weigh prudence. John McCain, Jr. also presented his birth certificate immediately to the public when said had become in question. "If you really think that Obama has any allegiance to Kenya or England, you're off your rocker. It does matter what I think nor you. The clause is a preventative measure. I don't like traffic laws either so we should do away with them and assume everyone will drive safely?. Why the Supreme Court has dismissed these cases because there has been no substantive Constitutional violation as of yet, in short, he's not the President yet nor has been confirmed. The Supreme Court only rules on constitutional related issue's. If the Electoral College denies Barack Obama, Jr. the Presidency based on he fails to qualify under the " natural born " clause then the case will go to the Supreme Court and he will most certainly lose. "I also don't know why you're quoting the Declaration of Independence, which predates the Constitution. Unlike the Declaration, the Constitution is legally binding and only invokes religion insofar as it limits the state's involvement with it". These are all sequential documents relative to each other. Are you saying that the Bill of Rights is not binding nor a legal probative document?. You just shot yourself in the foot. I only brought up the 1st. Amendment some posts back as a testament to your ignorance. If you want to continue to sound like an idiot find with me. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion" = Congress shall legislate "no law" forming a national church, based in religious doctrine or one religion over another. God is not particular of nor favors a religion, nor does the Constitution ban religion or god from Government. This only applies to it's legislative authority. Nowhere in any historical or modern legal document does any reference to a particular religion appear. What does appear is " God ". You have the typical liberal argument Tom which is boring, hypocritical, without fact and always self-serving. You want things to mean one thing when it serves your interest and another when it does not. Your not worthy debating because you simply do not know what your talking about nor have an educated thought. If you want anyone to become President, be governed by those who are morally void, by those who think they are the higher power and judged in a court of law with absolutely no moral conviction, move and go start your own country. " God is as American as baseball and apple pie. Get over it or move. Why stay in the greatest country ever to serve humanity when you know better. Your either a product of public education, work within it's sytem or both. Most likely born in the 1950's early 1960's I'll bet. - RichieRich Sat, 03 Jan 2009 14:27:54 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1070 There are two kinds of citizens: those who are natural-born and those who are naturalized. The fourteenth amendment made Obama a citizen at the time of his birth because he was born in the United States. As such, when you combine the manner in which English common law recognized natural born citizens and the fourteenth amendment, Obama is natural born and did not have to be naturalized. The hilarious thing is that your misreading of the Natural Born Citizen Clause may also disqualify John McCain. One could argue that John McCain isn't a natural born citizen because he was not born on U.S. soil. However, that would be ridiculous. If you really think that Obama has any allegiance to Kenya or England, you're off your rocker. None of the concerns expressed by Jay apply to him. Obama didn't need to appear in court because the case was dismissed at every level. But now you're switching to a different argument (the Birth Certificate issue) which was clearly addressed by the government that actually verifies birth information. Did you even read the Slate article? Lastly, I have no idea what point you're trying to make by haggling about the first amendment. But I'll humor you and state that the first amendment requires government neutrality towards religion. Religion is a matter of personal conscience in the private sphere and not something with which the state should be entangling itself. You could look up Europe's blood-soaked history or Jefferson's letter if you want to know why this is a good idea. I also don't know why you're quoting the Declaration of Independence, which predates the Constitution. Unlike the Declaration, the Constitution is legally binding and only invokes religion insofar as it limits the state's involvement with it. - Tom Moore Sat, 03 Jan 2009 00:49:54 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1055 I forgot to address the rest of your intellectual drivel. Case law woud pertain to cases that courts have ruled on. Since no other idiot's but your political party were ignorant enough to not understand what " natural born " means no case law exists on the subject. You see any case law where a court ruled on whether a red light meant you had to stop?. Separation of Church and State; Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; Where in the above would one conclude that God was to be absent in Government. [quote]the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's "God" entitle them. We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their "Creator" with certain unalienable Rights. End of story [/quote] - RichieRich Fri, 02 Jan 2009 10:59:07 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1054 [quote]All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.[/quote] You see " natural born " anywhere in the above. The fourteenth amendment pertains to citizenship. Congress has alot of citizens, unfortunately many are not " natural born ". Sorry to burst your bubble, not. You have all the symptoms Tom of someone in denial. This is 5th grade material. Barack Obama, Jr knows he is not a " natural born " citizen that's why the DNC and Barack Obama, Jr himself are going to such great lengths to prevent this from coming out. Do you know of any other reason why Barack Obama, Jr would not simply answer the plethora of legal motions in the courts?. The man gives numerous media interviews and one would think with all the legal motions that he would take 5 seconds and hold his birth certificate to the camera. Hell, I'd make copies and autograph them. - RichieRich Fri, 02 Jan 2009 10:36:11 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1048 Uh, the fourteenth amendment post-dates any letter written by John Jay. None of the forefathers were even alive when that amendment was drafted. The citizenship clause made Obama a citizen at birth and he never had to be naturalized. The Supreme Court already considered this case and rightfully dismissed it without comment. If you are born here, you are a natural born citizen. You have yet to point to any case law suggesting otherwise. The best thing you have to offer is an ideologically motivated secondary source that (a) you ripped from wikipedia, along with the rest of your drivel and (b) doesn't say what you think it says. It only says that someone born to two citizens is a natural born citizen, not that someone with only one citizen parent isn't. I also find it hilarious that you put so much stock in a letter from John Jay, rather than the actual text of the Constitution, and are engaging in the same mistake that you accuse church-state separationists of making. As for separation of church and state, that is an interpretation of the Establishment Clause offered by Thomas Jefferson in a letter that he wrote to a church. Note that the first amendment doesn't say "establishment of *a* religion," but "establishment of religion." But that really has nothing to do with what we are talking about. Lastly, the forefathers were grandfathered in because they were not born in the United States (it didn't even exist when they were born). Not to mention that the fourteenth amendment didn't exist at the time (but reading the Constitution was never the strongest suit of the American right, as evidenced by the way you all shredded the document during the past eight years). Obama is a loyal, natural born American citizen. He has no British or Kenyan agenda. He is not the son of an Iraqi dictator. He was primarily raised by his mother. He is going to be your President. Put your white hood away and get used to it. - Tom Moore Fri, 02 Jan 2009 03:15:24 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1030 Dr. Orly Taitz has very articulatly pointed out the dangers in not enforcing the law. See her at http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6771521759788800576&ei=Lc5cSZbpMJ-2-wGZ7JnnDA&q=WTP Obama Citizenship Challenge or search "Orly Taitz" on youtube. Dr. Taitz is only a Bronze Citizen, but she shows more patriotism than most Silvers and Golds, sad to say. Dr. Taitz shows clearly that there is a very grave danger that Osama Bin Laiden could become the next President of the United States after Obama, if we do not force the Supere Court to Act Now. - KMays Thu, 01 Jan 2009 08:17:40 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1022 [quote]Your hypothetical about Putin having a child born in the U.S. is just bizarre. I suppose that in an alternate reality where Putin moves the U.S. and has a child with an American citizen, that child could be President some day. What an amazing argument. [/quote] What's hypothetical about it. The American people just elected a President who's Father wasn't a citizen of the United States. Not only that, his Father was a government official of Kenya. [quote]Putin moves the U.S. and has a child with an American citizen[/quote] Who say's he or his son has to move. According to your logic she could conceive the child in Russia and give birth in the United States and abbakadabra a " natural born " citizen or one of them could be visiting the United States. I actually find it amazing that I have to convince you as an American of the dangers of allowing a President that is not the offspring of 2 American cictizens. I mean how screwed up is that. You want to talk about " bizarre ". - RichieRich Wed, 31 Dec 2008 09:39:12 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-1020 There are numerous letter's from that period in history which sheds light on what " natural born " was intended to mean. John Jay would be one of them. You also have to have an understanding of that period of history to fully understand the Constitution. I'll bet you think there is a Separation of Church and State clause in the Constitution don't you. The Separation of Church and State is a concept. That concept was never intended to remove religion from government. It was to prevent the government from forming a national religion and legislating law based on religious doctrine. What you have today is an interpretation abomination by none other then the usual suspects, liberals. You have to understand where our forefathers were from to understand why clauses, amendments appear as they do and the thinking behind them. If the Supreme Court gets this case they will have no other alternative but to disqualify Barack Obama, Jr. If the Electoral College allows him to be President they should all be arrested and charged with Fraud. " It is generally agreed that these constitutional provisions mean anyone born on American soil to "parents" who are U.S. citizens is a “natural born citizen” eligible to someday become president or vice-president". Sources; Professor of Law and Philosophy and Co-Director of the University of Illinois's Institute for Law and Philosophy, wikipedia. I'm sure you can find other on-line sources. I'm not your mother. I'll say this one more time. It doesn't matter where Barack Obama, Jr was born. The fact that his Father was not an American Citizen disqualifies him. Doesn't it strike you odd Tom that other then our forefathers that were for lack of better words grand fathered in by the Constitution with this neat little wording " or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution " that every President forward has been the offspring of 2 American citizens. Tell me Tom is there any other legal document with exception to the Constitution President and Vice President requirements that the wording " natural born " appears?. - RichieRich Wed, 31 Dec 2008 07:21:13 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-998 Are you people serious? Gold citizenship? What clause of the Constitution or court case did you get that garbage from? Pointing to random people you don't like who could theoretically move here and have a child to one day be President is a terrible argument. Not only is that the worst plan to take over a nation in the world (it's pretty hard to become President in the first place, much less if you are the son of the most hated man in the world), you could say that about any group. David Duke and the members of Westboro Baptist Church are gold citizens whose kids could be President. That doesn't mean they're ineligible. This is your argument summed up: http://www.salon.com/comics/boll/2008/04/03/boll/ - Tom Moore Tue, 30 Dec 2008 12:07:41 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-996 I suspect alot of liberal comments here are from 2nd or 3rd class citizens who are ashamed of thier status so they want to put everyone in the same melting pot. But there are degrees of birth that can never be erased. Case in Point: Someone says "Yeah, I guess if Putin immigrated her and had a child, that son or daughter would be just as eligible for the Presidency as the child of any other immigrant." That is clearly absurd. Are they trying to say that if Osama Bin Laden and Sadem Hussain moved to Massachusets and got got gay married and adopted a child borne in south Florida that child would be a Gold Citizen? Obviously not. Just shows how ridiculous thier argument is. Proud to be Gold! KMays - KMays Tue, 30 Dec 2008 03:17:31 +0100 http://www.rightsidenews.com/200810262351/editorial/obamas-birth-certificate-still-missing.html#comment-986 Um, natural born means you're a citizen from birth. If you have any case law suggesting otherwise, I would be interested to hear it. There is a reason that even the staunch conservatives on the Court dismissed this case without comment. Obama was not naturalized. He was born here and is a natural born citizen. Your hypothetical about Putin having a child born in the U.S. is just bizarre. I suppose that in an alternate reality where Putin moves the U.S. and has a child with an American citizen, that child could be President some day. What an amazing argument. Last I checked, Uday Hussein wasn't born in the U.S., but if that's how far you have to stretch to make some semblance of an argument, more power to you. But I think that I'll stick with the the Justices of the Supreme Court and the government of Hawaii, rather than the ravings of anti-Semitic, 9/11 denying lunatics who are terrified that a black man will be President next month. Your paranoid rantings about socialism failed to win the election and they will certainly fail to stop Obama from being sworn in. You lost. Get over it. - Tom Moore Mon, 29 Dec 2008 19:57:54 +0100